Curse

mortalis doleo · Dec 12, 2005, 09:42 PM // 21:42

i like minion factories.
i have never lost to a minion factory.
i have never been in a minion factory that people know what they are doing in.
im desperate.
here is my idea for a minion factory, please give me feedback and stuff.

2 rezmers:
1. vengence
2. restore life
3. life barrier
4. life bond

2 saccers:
1. illusion of weakeness
2. blood is power
3. sup runes = instent death...
another option is to get BiP saccers without sup runes, and get fertile season, so that the minions do not die until told to.

heal area mo/e:
1. heal area
2. ward vs melee
3. ward vs elements
4. ward vs foes
rest healing spells and what not...

spirit spammer trapper r/me:
1. winnowing
2. healing spring
3. barbed trap
4. dust trap
5. serpent's quickeness
6. mantra of resolve
7. spike trap
8. res sig
this guy can also be part warrior with charge!... but he will lose spike trap and be more volnerable to interrupts.

2 minion masters:
1. create bone minions
2. create bone horror
3. vereta's aura
4. taste of death
5. vereta's sacrifice
6. death nova
7. dark bond
8. res sig/chosen elite, could be echo for vereta's sacrifice...

sooooooooo...... what do we do with this???

like any minion factory, the saccers die and get ressed constantly.
the heal area monk... heals the area... when the battle starts, he uses wards around the MMs.
if there are BiP saccers, the rezmers use life barrier on two other characters.
the spirit spammer uses traps on the door of the base when the timer starts, and when the enemy comes, he uses winnowing at the back of the base.
the minion masters create only melee fiends, swapping between types when the other is recharging (bone minions should be the main focus).

now.........
once the team gets attacked, one of the MM goes insane, and gets angry at his attacking minions!
he chooses one of them, and casts death nova + taste of death on him, until it is dead, causing a spike to whoever is close to it. that MM does this until the battle is won (loosing is impossible).
the other MM keeps spamming minions.

i think that covers the MF gissin style...
what do you think?

P.S
i know that minion factories are stupid builds to some people, and that the minion masters can easilly be spiked with rend and spells, but try not to look at this as a normal build... try to look at it like a MF improvement...

im done now, you can call me a noob... just leave me a shred of dignity and self respect... please...

mortalis doleo · Dec 13, 2005, 02:05 PM // 14:05

50 people viewed the thread, and no comments

im bumping it for the first and last time, if you dont like the build, just say i suck... its better than nothing...

Bugeater · Dec 13, 2005, 02:32 PM // 14:32

I was just hoping for something surprisingly new. But it looks like this build is only a slight tweak on a typical MF build. Minion Factories are interesting the first time or two you look at them, but they're pretty one-dimensional so I'm not that keen on them. Maybe someone who likes them better would have some better input than me.

Plus I don't like your avatar.

fiery · Dec 13, 2005, 02:36 PM // 14:36

missing main spirits.. fw winnowing some others...u need veratas gaze.. trapper needs HS(healing spring) fiends only. no minions or horrors.

also i stopped doing this cause it takes to long to just kill ghost team..fun though versus a human team..

eoe,frozen soil, and I useally as a tainter blow up the bodies before ppl can minion them.

SMART MF bring a lvl 1 eoe..so they might last a bit.

mortalis doleo · Dec 13, 2005, 03:20 PM // 15:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by fiery

missing main spirits.. fw winnowing some others...u need veratas gaze.. trapper needs HS(healing spring) fiends only. no minions or horrors.

also i stopped doing this cause it takes to long to just kill ghost team..fun though versus a human team..

eoe,frozen soil, and I useally as a tainter blow up the bodies before ppl can minion them.

SMART MF bring a lvl 1 eoe..so they might last a bit.

you say only fiends, no melee fighters.
you apparently didnt read my post, since i said i am trying something new...
as a tainted necro, you should know the power of this build, since you should be adept at the usage of death nova...
you didnt comment about the idea of the build, you just said the normal build.
if you think the normal build is better, at least say why...
and why vereta's gaze when you have vereta's aura?

and asfor bug eater, the feeling is mutual.

funkho · Dec 13, 2005, 04:40 PM // 16:40

I don't really know too much about using death nova, but here are some issues I see with this...

First, I'm not sure that taste of death allows you to target which minion. So it's possible that you'll have to blow up a couple before you get your nova'd one.

Second, the most common counter to MF is EoE, so if you're killing your own minions, you can expect to see your MF with no M really fast.

I also really like MF and have been pretty successful with it. I think it's funny that people say MF never works and stuf like that. That's really like saying balanced never works because you ran up against a balanced PUG and owned it. The problem with MF is that it has a reputation for being worthless... I really feel like it's a viable build if you fix the problems.

I would love to get a group of people together that would like to get good with MF. I believe there will be a day when people see those minions and at least expect a fight... When you see my minion team, you normally can... Well run MF owns IWAY with ease...

-Funk

Bugeater · Dec 13, 2005, 04:40 PM // 16:40

lol, yeah my avatar sucks hard, but I can't find a better one.

One other thing that makes minion bombing hard is that there isn't a good way to target your minions. So you can't just tab through them and nova them all or easily select ones that are about to die anyway.

judge1121 · Dec 13, 2005, 04:46 PM // 16:46

the normal build is much better since it does more dmg. life bond and life barrier can help but that drains energy of rezmers even with BiP. u cant target the minon u gonna kill and if they all went wild they target the closest thing to them and that is usually u. and b4 u can even do taste of death since u are making a mf group meaning lots of minions, well with lots of them they could take u down pretty quick. is not improving a lot is mostly doing somethign different giving new weaknesses and new strengths. so matter wat though spike groups would still own MF. mostly ele spike as they can just kill the MMs (they have enchant removal of course) and then laugh at u when they see ur own minions killing u. im not saying that i dont like MF, is fun and stuff. But u havent made a lot of improvements in the build. and u forgot rezmers need Mantra of Recall. i think gaze is better for the fact that is spamale and if u just do it u can get a few minions to kill other minions without targeting to kill them else ur own minions will follow. i guess aura is better if u fight in close range after both teams finish making minions.

mortalis doleo · Dec 13, 2005, 05:05 PM // 17:05

im gonna reply to everyone, since i suck at quoting more than one person in a single post

first, and MOST important, you the minion you target is the minion that taste of death will effect.
second, the idea isnt to use death nova on ALL the minions, since that is impossible. you choose a minion (doesnt matter which, since they are all near an enemy - melee), and use death nova on it, then kill it off. then pick a new minion... so on so forth.
thirdly, bringing fertile season counters a lot of EoE's damage, and bringing a 0att EoE is a good idea (just like bringing 0 att fertile season is good for EoE teams...).
as for spikers killing off the MMs, they will kill one of them if they are good, but the other one will immidiately use vereta's aura, meaning the minions are still ours. the dead MM will be ressed quickly.

lastly, the normal build isnt better than this one (IMO...), it's just different.
this isnt a small tweak, since the entire idea of the MF is changed. instead of going ranged and consistant with damage, you go with melee (traps included) and less damage, but big spike damage. instead of trying to keep your minions alive in battle, you kill them ff one by one.

i cant deny the obvious flaws in this build, since they are the same flaws as a normal MF...
1. frozen soil sucks badly, but the damage to te build is reduced, since you still cause a lot of damage with death nova spikes.
2. EoE is less terrible with fertile + att 0 EoE, but it still hurts the build...
3. spiking the MM is still just as bad, but just like a normal MF, vereta's aura is always handy.

what i am sure of, is that this build is much better than a normal MF, in altar matches...
the minions cause a big body block (sometimes all around the enemy team), allowing the trapper to lay his traps, hitting all of the enemies, and the death nova spikes hurt the entire enemy team...

yep... im done now...

edit:
kinda funny you guys answered together, in the same 6 minute range

fiery · Dec 13, 2005, 05:08 PM // 17:08

think about it melee versus fiend minions...which is better..want your minions to run up and start whacking... or on command fire off whatever they shoot off in range attack..plus with FW more attack speed and power..FW doesnt work with minons or horrors..as for veratea gaze or whichever..referring to the one that takes control of all hostile minions..not the one by one control skill..at school so cant check it..

Quote:

"as a tainted necro, you should know the power of this build, since you should be adept at the usage of death nova...
you didnt comment about the idea of the build, you just said the "

taint necro is WAY diffrent than a necro in MM...taint necros taint/deathnova/wells etc...MM dont have time to see health of the minions enough to death nova them..

as for my taint remark.. i was referring as I, as a tainter was a major threat VS MF. not a taint in MF.

FW was a key for more damage..

plus ele/monk would be better.. +3 on wards plus more engery and elem damage reduction on armor.

mortalis doleo · Dec 13, 2005, 07:34 PM // 19:34

technically, FW shouldnt work on fiends, since they are not arrows...
if it does, than either the description should be changed, or the effect on fiends should be changed...

as for the tainted remark, it isnt too dangerous, since the minions wont be near the suiciders, they will be near the enemies (when an enemy drops, it gets dangerous).

as for tainted being different than an MM necro, it isnt too different in my build.
in yours, you look for low health and use death nova. in mine, you look for a minion and cast death nova + taste of death.
note: in my build the death nova spike is guaranteed, and happens every 3-4 seconds.

i think melee can be better than ranged, in a sense that the minions will circle the enemy team, causing a body block.
this then makes the traps and the nova effect all of the enemies. (bleeding, poison, cripple, blind and interrupt).

and yeah, going e/mo is a good option...
whenever i play saccer, i always go full hp and bring wards... so whatever you choose, you can adjust to it...

judge1121 · Dec 13, 2005, 08:20 PM // 20:20

the tainted thing
well it is not the same as in mf. in mf u dont have a party window to look at ur minions health. in IWAY u do.
and yes minons cause body blocks but they also body block you from moving. like they stand in archway and dont let u move as the eles spike u from afar. and also fiends are better because they wont have the likelyhood toset off traps and with eoe down then say bye bye minions.
u are also thinking that u set off the minions to go fight someone. but most MF groups get beaten b4 they leave to go and fight.

Bale_Shadowscar · Dec 13, 2005, 09:03 PM // 21:03

You seem to have Vereta's sacrifice twice on the Minion Masters. I assume one means Vereta's aura.

Still, looks like a good build. Only trouble now is getting accomplished people to play with...

mortalis doleo · Dec 13, 2005, 09:06 PM // 21:06

when i say MF... i mean camp the ell out of the base

when they come, the minions will attack by themselves, and traps wont have much time to be set.

if the minions are blocking an archway, it is because a person is being attacked there. just help clear the way by blasting him with nova...

as for ele spike... the MMs should be at the back of the base, and the monk should have infuse health... that obviously isnt enough, but if you are fighting a good spike team, then there is no way you can block the spike...

another thing... currently, there are more ranger spikers than there are air spikers. rangers cant shoot through walls.

but i get your points... i still like my build, im bios towards it

edit:
and yeah, i ment aura... ill fix it.

judge1121 · Dec 13, 2005, 10:41 PM // 22:41

still u know if u got eoe and u kill ur minions u gonna set of a chain right?

mortalis doleo · Dec 14, 2005, 10:00 AM // 10:00

your 0 attribute eoe will only cause 14 damage each time, and you will only drop the eoe if the enemy team drops an eoe (you drop your's to kill their's).

funkho · Dec 14, 2005, 08:39 PM // 20:39

Actually, as a counter to EoE, I think bringing fertile season is good... It would be even better if someone else could bring the 0 level EOE and the ranger could bring a high level predatory and fertile... That would shut down the EoE counter pretty effectively... Maybe the minion master should be N/R with zero in beast...

mortalis doleo · Dec 14, 2005, 08:44 PM // 20:44

i tried this earlier today, and even though the players weren't too competent (13 death attribute for MM anyone???), i could see that this build won't work

never mind... at least i tried